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Two-person fingerloop - advice needed

Hello everyone,

I'm hoping to do some two-person fingerloop braids with a friend this weekend. However, I'm getting horribly confused by the notation and whose hands go where. I was hoping to do some of the braids from here:

Does anyone have any advice/hints/tips? Favourite two-person braids? Easy two-person braids? Instructions?

This'll mostly just be for fun. However, my friend has never done fingerloop before (though he has done just about every other sort of braiding one can think of), so I'm hoping to a) make something reasonably pretty and/or impressive, to convince him it's a good technique but also b) not get in a horrific tangle, despite being two beginners, and thus scare him off from ever helping me with them again. :)

Thanks in advance!

EDIT: Just to say, I'm particularly getting confused with the instructions that say "work with inner hands" or "work with outer hands". Does this mean if I am on the left and my partner is on my right, our hand go l->r like this: my left, their left, my right, their right? Or do the hands go: my left, my right, their left, their right? 

I.e. do my hands work as a pair and my partner's hands work as a pair, with occasional exchanges between these two pairs? Or do my l. hand and their l. hand work as a pair, and my r. hand and their l. hand work as a pair, with occasional exchanges between these two pairs? 

EDIT 2: Sorry guys, removed the link when re-writing for clarity and forgot to put it back in.
Here is my primary source for patterns
Here is my second source of patterns

An example of a braid with instructions to "work with inner hands" would be t29. Interestingly, I just noticed another braid which instructs to "work with left hand" or "work with right hand".

Comments

( 12 comments — Leave a comment )
ladymurmur
Jul. 31st, 2012 09:20 pm (UTC)
Did you mean to include a link? I don't see anything after "from here:"

I've done one-person fingerloop braiding - it never occurred to me that more than one person could do it at a time! Very curious to see your source. :-)
paantha
Aug. 1st, 2012 05:41 pm (UTC)
Sorry - links are fixed now.

There is theorised to be a European tradition of using up to 4 braiders: http://www.lmbric.net/n4/n4.html (see "III: Openwork Insertion).

There certainly are European patterns that require up to 3 braiders: http://www.silkewerk.com/braids/braid_41.html
winterton
Jul. 31st, 2012 09:45 pm (UTC)
Without knowing where you're looking at, so please check the source and make sure this makes sense (I haven't worked multiperson braids either):

Remember that two-person braids presume two braiders standing next to each other.

Presumably, then, "inner hands" would mean the braiders' hands closer to each other, on the inside; "outer hands" would mean the braiders' hands further from each other, on the outside.

It's hard to tell the specifics without being able to see what pattern you're looking at, though.

Good luck and have fun!
paantha
Aug. 1st, 2012 06:29 pm (UTC)
Apologies - the links are now fixed. I'd appreciate any input you may have.
winterton
Aug. 1st, 2012 07:44 pm (UTC)
Without having a partner to work through t29 with ... it does look like you work primarily between your own hands. (If your partner is on your right, your outer hand will be your left hand, your inner hand will be your right hand; if your partner is on your left, the other way around -- this will keep the pattern symmetrical between the two of you.) Then you exchange loops with your partner where indicated, in the third part of the instructions, and repeat working the first two parts on your own hands again before exchanging with your partner.

t34 is complex enough that I can't keep what all the threads are doing in my head, but again, outer should be "the hand away from your partner" and inner should be "the hand toward your partner."

This looks enormously nifty and I wish I could join the two of you! And thank you so much for the amazing links; I hadn't heard about silkewerk.com before, and I foresee some happy hours blistering the sides of my fingers. :)
paantha
Aug. 2nd, 2012 05:14 pm (UTC)
Thank you for your input. I had another look at the t29 and t34 and I think I have figured it out:

"work with inner/outer hand" perhaps means use YOUR left/right hand while your partner does nothing
"work with right/left hand" perhaps means both people do identical moves but work with themselves

Either that or they are equivalent terms.

In any case, you have been very helpful. Sometimes someone else's input is just what you need.

I have some more links to useful fingerloop pages on my blog: blackcatsews.blogspot.co.uk
paantha
Aug. 4th, 2012 10:05 am (UTC)
Just to say, someone else has chimed in below and now I understand it.

Both "inner/outer" and "left/right" mean both people do the move individually. The difference is "inner/outer" results in the two people doing a mirror-image of each other. "Right/left" results in the two people doing identical moves.
emmespins
Aug. 3rd, 2012 08:31 pm (UTC)
Two worker loop braiding
For the first three steps, you and your partner are working alone, but simultaneously. Just as if you were making your own one-worker braids. After the third step, you need to connect your two braids together into a single braid. That's when you exchange loops with your partner.

Your inner hands, the ones that are next to each other and back to back, are the hands you're working with for this one step. All your doing is trading one loop with your parter. That ties your braid to his/hers. Repeat from the beginning. The only time you have to pay attention to your partner is when you trade loops. ;)
paantha
Aug. 4th, 2012 10:04 am (UTC)
Re: Two worker loop braiding
Thank you!

So, essentially "use inner/outer hand" and "use right/left hand" both mean "both people work individually and do this move". The difference is that in the inner/outer version the moves of the two people are doing mirror-images of each other. In the right/left version, the moves are just straight copies of each other.

I think I have it!
emmespins
Aug. 4th, 2012 12:55 pm (UTC)
Re: Two worker loop braiding
Yes! Unless it says "trade loops on your inner hands" in which case you must borrow an inner hand from your partner. But the directions underneath should make that clearer.

I glad to hear your questions. It's always a challenge to write clear directions. Perhaps it's time to add some video or tutorials or something,

I finally finished the alternate index, so now you can "shop" for braids by picture instead of just number and name.

Http://www.silkewerk.com/braids/index
paantha
Aug. 8th, 2012 06:08 pm (UTC)
Re: Two worker loop braiding
Brilliant! Thank you so much. Unfortunately, although we got around to fingerloop last weekend we did not get as far as two-person fingerloop. However, it is very useful for the next time I find someone to bully into trying it... ^_^
emmespins
Aug. 4th, 2012 01:02 pm (UTC)
Re: Two worker loop braiding
Yes!

Except when it says "trade loops on your inner hands" in which case you need to borrow a hand from your partner. The instructions after that should make that clearer.

I'm glad to answer any questions. It's always hard to write good instructions! It might be time for me to add some video, or tutorials.

I finished the alternate index for the braids, so now you can "shop" by picture and type rather than just by name and number. I hope it helps!

Http://www.silkewerk.com/braids/index
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